(House of Representatives - July 25, 1996)

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[Pages H8521-H8522]
From the Congressional Record Online through the Government Publishing Office [www.gpo.gov]

                            A PARTISAN SMEAR

  The SPEAKER pro tempore (Mr. Hobson). Under a previous order of the 
House, the gentleman from California [Mr. Waxman] is recognized for 5 
  Mr. WAXMAN. Mr. Speaker, I want to point out how outrageous it is 
that the gentleman from Pennsylvania [Mr. Clinger], the chairman of the 
committee, that has been investigating whether there has been an 
invasion of privacy by the gathering of FBI files would come to the 
floor and disclose information that he has from FBI files. It seems to 
me that, if we are talking about protecting people's privacy, it is out 
of line to come to the floor and use information that has not been 
verified, presumably from some FBI file, to try to smear the First 
Lady, Bernard Nussbaum, the counsel, and the Democratic administration. 
This is a partisan smear.
  I have information that I am going to insert in the Record that 
contradicts the statement made by the gentleman from Pennsylvania [Mr. 
Clinger]. I want to point out that, when a Member of Congress speaks 
from the House floor, he is protected. We can say anything we want. No 
one can file a lawsuit against us. But that does not give us the right 
to come here and disclose information that ought not to be disclosed.
  If there is an accusation about people in the White House having 
gathered FBI files improperly, that accusation appears to be accurate, 
but there has been no showing that any of that information was ever 
made public or used for political purposes. But what we have here right 
now is the use politically of information from the FBI.
  I include for the Record these statements that contradict what has 
been alleged on the House floor and to point out to the Members that 
this kind of activity, it seems to me, is outrageous and is really 
uncalled for.
  The material referred to is as follows:

                                       U.S. Department of Justice,

                              Federal Bureau of Investigation,

                                    Washington, DC, July 19, 1996.
     Hon. William F. Clinger,
     Chairman, Committee on Government Reform and Oversight, House 
         of Representatives, Washington, DC.
       Dear Mr. Chairman: I have been advised that you and 
     Committee Counsel Barbara Olson visited the FBI yesterday for 
     the purpose of reviewing the background investigation files 
     of Craig Livingstone and Anthony Marceca. As you know, the 
     FBI's investigations of Mr. Livingstone and Mr. Marceca were 
     undertaken at the request of the White House and the results 
     of the investigations were previously provided to the White 
       After your review of these files, I understand that you 
     noted that neither of the summary memoranda reflecting the 
     results of the FBI's investigation of Mr. Livingstone 
     reflected certain specific information recorded as a result 
     of the FBI's interview of Bernard Nussbaum, then counsel to 
     the President. You asked what the FBI's response would be if 
     the White House requested any additional information from the 
     file beyond the summary memoranda furnished.
       As you know, the FBI conducts background investigations for 
     various congressional committees and other government 
     entities, including the White House. With regard to requests 
     for background investigations from the Department of Justice, 
     the Department of Energy, the Nuclear Regulatory Commission, 
     and the Administrative Office of the U.S. Courts, the FBI 
     provides the actual investigative reports. Only certain 
     information is withheld, e.g., if an interviewee requests 
     that his identity be protected from disclosure outside the 
     FBI. With regard to background investigations conducted 
     for congressional committees and the White House, by 
     agreement the FBI provides summary memoranda that 
     synopsize the information in the underlying investigative 
     reports. Since 1983, at the request of the White House, 
     the FBI also attaches to the summary memoranda any FD-302s 
     that reflect derogatory information. So, for example, the 
     FBI's communication that provided the White House with the 
     results of the remainder of the Bureau's investigation of 
     Mr. Livingstone included an FD-302 reflecting the results 
     of an interview with an individual who volunteered 
     derogatory information. The summary memoranda are intended 
     to address all the concerns of the client entity 
     requesting the background investigation but if that client 
     asks for additional information from the report, the FBI 
     would provide the requested information subject to certain 
     limitations, e.g., the interviews specifically requests 
       You also expressed concern as to whether the information in 
     Mr. Livingstone's files, particularly with regard to the 
     record of the interview with Mr. Nussbaum, should be provided 
     to the White House by the FBI. You indicated that you would 
     want to know if the White House asked for or was provided 
     that information and what the justification for providing it 
     would be.
       During the course of this or any other oversight 
     investigation, the FBI works to cooperate fully with 
     congressional committees as well as any other agencies or 
     entities impacted by the inquiry. Our effort is to remain 
     non-partisan ensuring that facts within our possession which 
     are relevant to an inquiry are provided to affected entities 
     to the extent that we are aware of such an interest.

[[Page H8522]]

       When the FBI first learned from your staff that your 
     Committee was interested in looking at the background 
     investigative files of Mr. Livingstone and Mr. Marceca, the 
     files were reviewed to remove identifying information 
     relating to third parties as well as third agency 
     information. During this review, the information concerning 
     the results of the interview with Mr. Nussbaum were 
     identified. Because issues raised in Mr. Nussbaum's interview 
     had been discussed in connection with the Committee's 
     oversight investigation, it was determined that the Bureau 
     had a responsibility to advise affected parties. Therefore, 
     after arrangements were made for your staff to review the 
     files, the Department of Justice, and then the White House, 
     were advised of the results of this review. As you will 
     recall, we followed this procedure of full disclosure when we 
     first located the White House request for Barnaby Braeseux's 
     previous reports, which the Director advised you of 
     personally on June 5, 1996. In that instance, as in others, 
     you were advised of the information well in advance of any 
     notices being given to the White House.
       The minority staff of the Committee on Government Reform 
     and Oversight have not asked for further details about the 
     information in question. However, if they do so, the FBI will 
     similarly advise them.
       I hope this information is helpful to you. As the Director 
     has advised you, the FBI wants to continue to cooperate fully 
     with you in this matter. Please advise me if I can be of any 
     other assistance.
           Sincerely yours,
                                                Howard M. Shapiro,
     General Counsel.

  First Lady Hillary Clinton Q and A's in Bucharest, Romania, Monday, 
                              July 1, 1996

       Q from AP: Before we get too far along with our wonderful 
     Romanian visit, I want to clear up just one thing hanging 
     over Washington. Did you or to your knowledge, did Vince 
     Foster have anything to do with the hiring of Craig 
       A from HRC: I don't know anything about it, I know I 
       Q from AP: Do you have any reason to believe that Vince 
     Foster did?
       A from HRC: I have no reason believe that.
       Q from AP: Is there any connection between your mother and 
     Craig Livingstone's mother. Which is something the FBI agent 
     is claiming.
       A from HRC: The ``ex FBI Agent''? No there is no 
     connection. I do believe, if I ever meet the woman I'm going 
     to say ``Mrs. Livingstone I presume.''

First Lady Discussion With Traveling Press, Helsinki, Finland, July 10, 

       Q from ABC: I need to follow-up on one of Ron's questions. 
     When did you first meet Craig Livingstone? When did you 
     become aware that you knew him?
       A from HRC: I don't have any idea. I don't recall meeting 
     him for the first couple of years we were in the White House. 
     I just don't know him. I have met him since then, but my best 
     memory is sometime within the last year is the first time I 
     ever put a face and a name together.
       Q from AP: I really don't want to belabor this, but did I 
     understand you on the Livingstone question, that you don't 
     really have a memory of knowing him until this all happened?
       A from HRC: Ron, I did not know his mother. I did not know 
     him. I did not have anything to do with his being hired. And, 
     I do not remember even meeting him until sometime in the last 
     year. So, it does not mean I did not run into him. It does 
     not mean that I did not shake his hand in a receiving line. 
     All that could have happened. But, in terms of any connection 
     with this young man or any kind of relationship with him, 
     there was none.

 Deposition of William H. Kennedy, III, Committee on Government Reform 
                      and Oversight, June 18, 1996

       Q. Do you know if the First Lady was involved at all with 
     the hiring of Craig Livingstone in your office?
       A. I don't believe she was. I do not know one way or the 
     other. I don't believe so.
       Q. Do you recall ever saying to anyone that the First Lady 
     wanted to have Craig Livingstone in the position at the 
     Security Office at the White House?
       A. Me ever saying that?
       Q. Yes.
       A. I never said that.

             Statement of William H. Kennedy, June 29, 1996

       Gary Aldrich's account of a conversation with me about 
     Craig Livingstone's suitability for the job of Director of 
     Personnel Security is pure fiction. I never told Aldrich that 
     Mrs. Clinton wanted Mr. Livingstone in that post. I have 
     never had any discussion with Mrs. Clinton about Craig 
     Livingstone. No one else ever told me that Mrs. Clinton had 
     any interest whatsoever in Mr. Livingstone or his position.

Sworn Testimony of Craig Livingstone, Senate Judiciary Committee, June 
                                28, 1996

       Leahy: OK. I've also read in the press allegations that 
     come from unspecified sources that your mother is a close 
     friend of the first lady. Is she?
       Livingstone: No, sir.
       Leahy: And you have no idea who those sources are that tell 
     these things?
       Livingstone: No. sir. I've asked my mother and she, for the 
     record, says that she has never met Mrs. Clinton.

  Sworn Testimony of Craig Livingstone, House Committee on Government 
                  Reform and Oversight, June 26, 1996

       Horn: Well, what I'm curious now is, Mr. Marceca and Mr. 
     Livingstone, did Vice President Gore or Mrs. Clinton 
     recommend you for the position you held, Mr. Livingstone, to 
     your knowledge?
       Livingstone: I have no knowledge of that.
       Mica: Does anyone in your family have any relationship with 
     the first family?
       Livingstone: Absolutely not.